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  • It is currently Sat May 18, 2013 6:06 pm

IPL induced fat loss and Gentle Waves

This section of the forum is dedicated to discussions on fractionated, non-ablative, and ablative laser and non-laser skin treatment methods for facial conditions other than acne scarring (See Acne/Acne Scarring Forum).
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IPL induced fat loss and Gentle Waves

Postby Mistica » Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:59 pm

Dear Dr Lam,

I am yet another fat loss victim from IPL. So far, my case is not as severe as others, who have experienced over all volume loss. I am a female, 43 yrs old.
I have rosacea and have been having IPL treatments since the year 2000. This worked well and put me in complete remission.
Fast forward to more recently. I developed severe rosacea due to another doctor advising me to use topical retinyl palmitate. It was irritating and the end result was a crimson, swollen face with severe flushing and burning.
Attempts to reduce the symptoms with IPL, at my usual settings, caused adverse side effects. These included a dramatic increase in inflammation, and worsening of rosacea hell. In addition, I experienced etch type lines, a couple of indentations, orange peel skin and some loss of fat as indentations under the eyes. These are not overly disfiguring at the moment.
Where I had welts, the face has curved in slightly.
My nose was over treated, meaning the doctor did a double pass at energies far too high. It looks like orange peel texture with a slight loss of substance underneath.( lower third). When I gently press it, the firmness is lacking.

I have undergone about 9 red light therapy sessions in a doctor's clinic which has reduced these symptoms slightly. However more etch type lines are still forming. They aren't all lines. Some are squiggly ovals, as if someone ran a carving tool over my skin. Others are parallel lines, in the exact shape of the crystal. It is as if there was a power surge out of the sides.

Red light therapy helps some rosaceans, but for me, seeing my vasculature is so compromised, my face developes a horrible pressurized feeling and increased flushing for about a week afterwards.

I have read about Gentle Waves ( yellow light with pulsed deliverance) and wondered if treatment with this might halt the fat loss process?

http://www.gentlewaves.de/content/liter ... 3_2004.pdf

I realise it probably wouldn't rebuild the face, but to be able to stop it getting worse would be a bonus.
I see Gentle waves reduce MMP activity. The reduction of MMP activity through use of oral antibiotics in rosacea patients is thought to be how they achieve the anti inflammatory effect. Inflammation is destructive to collagen, so with that in mind, do you feel Gentle waves might benefit those undergoing the process of IPL induced fat loss?

I note that one of your theories of IPL/Laser induced fat loss is due to a lack of blood supply, however in my case, I am so red I could get a job as a beacon at the port, warning ships off the rocks. I wonder if the fat has simply been melted due to fluences being too high?

Yet my first fat loss happened at a time when the energies had not been raised, which begs the question of whether it is a result of inflammation? In the case of a rosacean, increased inflammation. I note in the article, that MMP's are increased after IPL/Laser.

I apologise for this post being so long, but sometimes a brief question loses its meaning.

Thank you for your time.
Mistica
 
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Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:26 pm
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Re: IPL induced fat loss and Gentle Waves

Postby dr. lam » Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:17 pm

I never like to speak from ignorance. However, from an intuitive point of view LEDs are so weak that I can't imagine it doing anything for anyone. To be honest, basic science studies in my opinion can be a bit bunk. i have mentioned before that i won an award in 2002 (John Orlando Roe Award) for understanding the effects of lasers on collagen growth in a pig model (very close to human skin). In a blinded analysis (legitimate unbiased science) we found that 589 nm laser (sound like the article?) caused collagen growth as much as ablative CO2 laser, i.e., charred skin. also, the N-lite that emanates the wavelength can be probably still found on ebay for 5 bucks. in other words clinically it did very little. i hate to say that i have very little trust in the results of the study you presented, but that is just my opinion (even with clinical photography results). i am not a dermatologist nor claim to be one. i hope you find resolution to your problem. when things have calmed down, i would be happy to discuss fat transfer if you are an appropriate candidate. hopefully, you won't need anything and you will be okay. :)
best,
sml
Samuel M. Lam, M.D., F.A.C.S.
Diplomate, American Board of Facial Plastic & Reconstructive Surgery
Diplomate, American Board of Otolaryngology Head & Neck Surgery
Diplomate, American Board of Hair Restoration Surgery
dr. lam
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Re: IPL induced fat loss and Gentle Waves

Postby dr. lam » Thu Feb 12, 2009 9:55 pm

cathy-fat-transfer.jpg
I just wanted all the IPL fat loss people to view this testimonial and results of a lady who is 11 months out from fat transfer to correct IPL induced injury and she continues to improve in her results. Here is a link to her YouTube video testimonial. It is pretty long:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_VQNm_3NHo
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Samuel M. Lam, M.D., F.A.C.S.
Diplomate, American Board of Facial Plastic & Reconstructive Surgery
Diplomate, American Board of Otolaryngology Head & Neck Surgery
Diplomate, American Board of Hair Restoration Surgery
dr. lam
Site Admin
 
Posts: 4994
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2007 10:51 am
Location: Dallas Texas
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